The Importance of Resilience in the field of Education

[00:00:00] You are listening to Resilient Life, the podcast where we explore the power of resiliency.

[00:00:10] I'm Nikita Ross. It is my hope that listeners at this podcast will give you the tools to

[00:00:17] connect with and increase your resiliency. So join me on this adventure of self discovery

[00:00:24] and self love. Thank you for joining this episode of Resilient Life, the podcast or

[00:00:34] week's score, The Power of Resiliency. Today we have an amazing guest, he is an educator,

[00:00:41] but I don't want to tell his story. No one tells your story better than you can.

[00:00:46] So I'm going to allow him to introduce himself. This week's guest please start with your name

[00:00:52] and your chosen profession and anything else you want to share.

[00:00:58] Hi my name is Karim Neal. I am a high school self-contained special education teacher at Mary

[00:01:05] Ball High School in the Phoenix Union High School District. This is my 27th year as a teacher

[00:01:11] and 17th year at Maryvale still loved the job. Oh, I was I was Arizona State Teacher of the

[00:01:19] year in 2019 and the first Arizona teacher inducted into the National Teachers Hall of Fame in

[00:01:24] 2022. I love that. I love everything about what you just said. For those who aren't familiar with

[00:01:34] the kiddos that you work with can you explain what a self-contained classroom is?

[00:01:40] Yes so my students are our standard high school 9 through 12 most of them come in as freshmen at 14

[00:01:47] most of them graduate at 18 however some can stay longer if we have needs that aren't met on IEPs.

[00:01:55] Their progress is determined much more about IEPs than standard grading.

[00:02:00] These students math and reading scores, psyched scores, psych evaluation scores usually fall between

[00:02:10] pre K and grade 1 or they're not in my program. Typically students in my class also have some

[00:02:18] physical needs, not all students but there will always be a student or two in my classroom who

[00:02:24] might require the use of a wheelchair or assistive devices for talking and things like that.

[00:02:31] They almost all of my students require health aids for things like safety around campus

[00:02:42] and even help with academic progress. And my instruction has to be differentiated strongly.

[00:02:51] I do teach the high school history standards and a high school science standards. I teach

[00:02:56] history in science however it is differentiated greatly so that all students and my class have a

[00:03:03] chance to learn self-contained classrooms most of the students also do not go out into all of the

[00:03:09] classrooms of a high school they use to stick in the other self-contained classrooms besides electives.

[00:03:16] And lastly if you saw the program the way that it is catered to make sure individuals get the needs

[00:03:25] that have their needs met. It would be a great program for all students. I wish that schools had

[00:03:31] the capacity to give all K-12s to pre K-12 students the opportunity to learn in the kind of

[00:03:39] environment that allows the differentiated instruction that we have, the small group instruction

[00:03:45] that we can have because there's also healthy to my classroom or they'll call them instructional aids

[00:03:50] or paraprofessionals. I've never heard of this before. If you were wondering about diagnosis it

[00:03:58] is autism or mild or moderate intellectual disability so they'll say M-O-I-D or M-I-I-D and also

[00:04:06] folks with Down syndrome usually fall into one of those categories as well. You were saying you never

[00:04:12] heard. I've never heard a self-contained classroom described in such a positive way before

[00:04:24] and a inclusive, if I think it's the word I want to say, an inclusive way how you're saying

[00:04:30] you wish that all students had which I'm going to ask you to explain another jargon phrase

[00:04:37] that you used for people who aren't an education IEP in a moment but I've not heard it described

[00:04:45] in a way that's so positive and inclusive saying that all students can benefit from a smaller

[00:04:52] learning environment. Yeah, so can you explain you said the word IEP? I know what it means and you

[00:05:00] know what it means but not everyone does so if you can explain that as well. Yes, IEP is an

[00:05:05] individual education plan and every student who has an IEP has an education team and on those

[00:05:16] education themes there's always a special education teacher, a general education teacher, district

[00:05:21] representative who signs things, a parent or a guardian, the student and then service providers if

[00:05:30] they have them speech language therapists occupational therapists physical therapists and they all

[00:05:36] do also have a school psychologist to make sure that they are still falling under special

[00:05:44] led requirements to to be in a self-contained classroom. And so in an IEP you essentially go over

[00:05:51] the students strengths, tell other students needs figure out what their goals are for the school year

[00:05:59] so that's why it's really individual so I don't just say I teach history in my class

[00:06:06] so right now I am teaching well it's economics now so it was government and economics this year

[00:06:11] and so I'm not just teaching income tax which is what I'm teaching right now because students in my

[00:06:17] classroom have IEPs and for instance some students I some students IEP might be you know they need

[00:06:24] to understand how to use money so I'm not going to go on an overview of income tax without

[00:06:30] making sure that that student understands how money works before we can even get into that kind

[00:06:35] of stuff so very individualized and obviously we're keeping it under the guys of what can be done

[00:06:43] at that school and then we say okay what goals can we make that would help the student progress

[00:06:48] and meet their goals for the year and hopefully have a great transition after high school.

[00:06:53] Um can I say a couple of things one?

[00:07:01] I you know this but I have a daughter who is special needs and she's been in a self-contained

[00:07:07] classroom and when I met you I was a little bitter because I felt like my daughter had been cheated

[00:07:16] meant she's had a couple of great teachers or good teachers but she never had a green.

[00:07:24] You are one of my favorite teachers I think regardless of the population you shine

[00:07:31] with our kids with additional needs um but I think you're just a great teacher in general every time

[00:07:38] I hear you talk about the work that you do you can just hear your passion your um it's this

[00:07:47] thing that you do where you don't uh lower your standards for our kids and it's one of my

[00:07:56] favorite things about you as an educator is that you adjust what does it mean

[00:08:05] lower does that make sense and so I don't know if I've ever told you that but uh you are

[00:08:12] one of my favorite educators on the planet and I've met in my position lots and lots of educators

[00:08:19] uh because you you do this for the right reason and in some magical way you also haven't or I

[00:08:27] haven't seen it uh you're not burned out can you talk a little bit about that I may be wrong maybe

[00:08:35] a burned out and you hide it really well no I have not and that was because so I so I started my

[00:08:42] teaching career in New Jersey where I grew up and I taught there I was a power professional at

[00:08:47] the school I taught at it's called the developmental learning center of new providence um but it's

[00:08:51] new profits New Jersey not Rhode Island and um you know going there I was learning so right that

[00:08:57] you're certainly not gonna burn out it's it's the beginning of my career I'm three years and

[00:09:00] and then I moved to Arizona and I'm at a school that does century integration it's uh kind of

[00:09:07] they're under world renowned occupational therapists Larnagine King who passed away years ago

[00:09:12] um and so we had hug machines and swings and doing a lot of stuff on proprioception and so I was

[00:09:20] learning again because that and New Jersey we were doing a B.A. applied behavior analysis so it was very

[00:09:25] strict learning and then when I got to Maryville because it's a comprehensive high school um I first

[00:09:33] tried to shield my kids from the general population general education population sorry because

[00:09:41] I had some biases of what those students were and not because of Maryville that that is not me I grew

[00:09:47] far tougher play but um I thought you know general ed students they're kind of wild they're kind of

[00:09:54] mean in my mind right I was listening to the world talk about kids sometimes and so you know so I

[00:10:02] started like that here and then when I branched out and saw kind of the beauty of all kids

[00:10:10] I then was like I got to find a way to connect this whole school because I was I was part of the

[00:10:16] disconnect for a little while you know my first two years here and so I think that keeps me on my

[00:10:23] toes because um it is not just about content although content has changed a lot too because of

[00:10:30] technology and things like that so I am a person who cares like I the thought of not being one of

[00:10:37] the best teachers for me would be scary um the thought of not giving my students everything and having

[00:10:44] their parents come to IP meetings happy because they're seeing their kids learn new things

[00:10:49] like those things would crush me so I think that's part of me um keeping that spirit alive but also

[00:10:56] this fight now to just make more inclusive environments in the in my school and and now around the

[00:11:03] country because I have the opportunity to do that so I think it keeps me fresh because that is it's not

[00:11:08] an easy thing to do like we as a population humans not this is not Mary Valorant in the humans

[00:11:16] we tend to like to hang with our people and so we we do self-segregate as well right um

[00:11:24] like I people don't realize since brown first board of education the school systems are just

[00:11:30] the segregated except now itself segregation now people are forced to go to a five school or

[00:11:35] white school the Latino school a Native American school and so you know I think taking on that

[00:11:44] such a big thing while still trying to give my students the best services I think it keeps me sharp

[00:11:51] it keeps me working hard for my students but also it's a fun job if anybody has

[00:11:59] um a connection to or they they've worked in a self-contained environment it could be the

[00:12:06] most fun place in the world um because I have a group of students who actually enjoy coming to

[00:12:13] school and that is rare for high schoolers a lot of high schoolers have a hard time with school

[00:12:17] they got to get up early they get lots of work and my students really love that and so our classroom

[00:12:25] community is so fun and full of love um and as a person when you teach someone something and they

[00:12:33] learn it it is a wild feeling I wish some of those because I know if you know I know you've gone

[00:12:39] through with some of those teachers that are kind of slack um sadly sometimes in self-contained

[00:12:45] environments people are like we could throw in a movie we could do some coloring if they

[00:12:50] felt the feeling of their students learning things that some of the gen at students don't understand

[00:12:57] right now that feeling is not a feeling that you can really get from anything other than

[00:13:02] teaching someone something that you know is going to make their life better so it's good

[00:13:07] so I'm never leaving. They're gonna be stuck with my old behind

[00:13:12] that was beautiful thank you for that I want to switch gears a little bit

[00:13:21] Korean I want to ask you how do you define resilience?

[00:13:29] well when I think about resilience when I think about those things I think about it to waste

[00:13:36] in the ways that it affects me and away it affects my students this is like my world do all the time

[00:13:42] it is um you know what I'd seem like it might be a lot but at this point it's second nature

[00:13:48] but you know when I think of resilience I truly think about you know what it takes for students who

[00:13:58] have all kinds of barriers in their way whether it be the physical barriers I've talked about my

[00:14:05] classroom the mental barriers I've talked about in my classroom the barriers of poverty and all

[00:14:11] of those things um you know the resiliency it takes to keep showing up is something that I admire

[00:14:21] and other people when I watch people who are resilient I'm like man how are they doing this with

[00:14:28] the smile in their face you know how is that student who these concepts are so difficult for them

[00:14:36] maybe you know letters on a page blend together I mean I'm sitting right in front of a magnifying

[00:14:43] class because one of my students um when she is working she would not be able to see the board without

[00:14:49] this man and I'm just like she's still driving though and so that resiliency to be like

[00:14:57] and obstacles not enough to stop me from achieving my goals is kind of how I think of it when I look

[00:15:05] at it in others when I see people who are just despite the things I am going to excel you know that's

[00:15:14] what I think about you and for me like I think for me it is when there's something that I'm not good at

[00:15:24] like when when people say to me and they say this to me a lot I don't know how you do that

[00:15:30] teaching those kids I'm like oh no that's easy I can't lie for not not necessarily prepping for my

[00:15:36] lessons and waking up early in the morning for a person like me who's a night person but it is

[00:15:42] because I really enjoy it and so it is the day it will I have an intrinsic motivation to do it right

[00:15:51] and when people are like oh you're traveling around the country and your busy sketch those things

[00:15:57] are easy to me but when we think about other things like you know how I am and relationships right

[00:16:04] how do I give grace to people those things are not easy to me and so for me it is when I fight through

[00:16:10] the things that I know um do not come easy to me uh that's when I feel like I'm being resilient

[00:16:17] and for me it is difficult because I've crafted my life in a way that is very comfortable so stepping

[00:16:23] outside of that is when I do feel like oh okay I am a resilient person I do not think I'm a resilient

[00:16:30] person a lot at a time but when I am like you know that person said blank blank blank blank about me

[00:16:37] and did blank blank blank blank to me and I gave grace then I feel like I was being resilient because

[00:16:41] that is not something that comes easy to me thank you for that very thoughtful answer I feel like

[00:16:49] you're not alone with staying in your comfort zone or default into your comfort zone I think we all

[00:16:56] do that as humans and I think a part of being resilient is stretching ourselves to grow and challenge

[00:17:04] ourselves to do something different that is or that is uncomfortable and so I love that you

[00:17:11] know that um you have the insight to realize that in those moments you are being resilient but there

[00:17:17] are other times that you're also very resilient in addition to the times where you're given people grace

[00:17:22] there are other times that you're probably not recognizing what I started to remember well I have

[00:17:26] to be resilient for a while there it was it was tough sledding for me at the beginning yeah so

[00:17:31] I know I've been resilient at times but now I do feel like I look for opportunities to grow and

[00:17:37] that that is hard for me because I have you know kind of made a solid little life for myself

[00:17:44] and so it's easy to sit in that and relax and and I don't and so I have to to kind of be mindful

[00:17:52] to try new things that can make my life better and so that that takes a lot of resiliency for me

[00:17:58] hmm I love that does that come with age or wisdom that you're saying uh you're trying to like

[00:18:08] encourage yourself to come outside of your comfort zone sometimes has it always been the case

[00:18:12] for you or is this just something that's developed with the way age and uh wisdom I developed with

[00:18:18] age and wisdom for me you know I think as a young person living it was a tougher thing for me so

[00:18:26] so I think my resiliency as a young person was a lot of what maybe these kids might go if

[00:18:31] there were some you know there's some poverty there's some some abuse in the home and things like that

[00:18:35] that were kind of big deal things that I had to be resilient I think um to get through but um when

[00:18:42] I when I started kind of my my career and I started doing well with that even in the beginning

[00:18:50] before like winning any awards or anything like that I was well received for my work

[00:18:55] and and then I was kind of settling into oh it is very easy for me to teach like I did last year

[00:19:02] because I how I taught last year worked out really well now I do not do that now I am like I can give

[00:19:08] my kids something better and in the summertime I'm thinking about that better thing that I can do

[00:19:13] for my classroom and you know it's it's funny to say but I could somebody talk to the

[00:19:19] Paris who won has been in my class for 10 years and the other eight years so we are we are quite a

[00:19:23] unit um they would say no he he definitely tries different things and stretches out every year

[00:19:31] um because I think I I think I I would be resting on my laurels and I think that was an an

[00:19:37] old thing it was like okay sure you're good at this thing but be better try to find a way to be

[00:19:43] better yeah I like that hey Kareem what made you smile today all the things let's see um I mean

[00:19:55] if you've been in a self-contained classroom and you're not smiling woo I don't know who you are but um

[00:20:01] so I would say first of all um the first thing to make me smile was we had we have a new student who

[00:20:10] started last week and that student has the hardest time with names and she breaks down everybody to

[00:20:18] what they look like it's the funniest thing ever so I have been tall guy for for five days uh you know

[00:20:25] and my my Paris were this or that lady or you know so she's all over the place and today she was

[00:20:33] leaving and said hey tall guy mr. Neal and I was like no you did not and so she was like yes I did

[00:20:40] and we actually start laughing right there on the spot so it was really that was really cool um

[00:20:48] and I think about even then after school except I think I have a lot of stories with my students that

[00:20:53] that make me smile but I was like with my staff after school and you know the semester was over our

[00:20:59] students left that it was a half day today and so we were here by ourselves kind of working

[00:21:06] and doing things like that and we all the three we have three self-contained classes at Maribou we

[00:21:11] all sat in my room and just kind of talked about the semester and not the semester the term sorry

[00:21:18] from January to now and just all the fun things that happened and so that made me smile because

[00:21:26] you know you you realize everybody is um and this and everybody really cares a lot it is such as

[00:21:33] a great staff at Maribou I wish more people could see the work that we were doing uh and then

[00:21:39] it happened a lot when I say morbid like during 2019 and 2022 people were up in my classroom all day

[00:21:46] but um but I welcome people to come and and I have a lot of the CBT teachers I feel like this is for

[00:21:53] you not for the listeners but I have a lot of the CBT teachers come visit so they can see kind

[00:21:58] of the structure of how it's being run and things like that but I think what people wind up doing is

[00:22:03] feeling like the love that that's there and so yeah so it's a it's a it's a really cool place to be

[00:22:10] I call it my Arizona home because I've been there at 17 years at Maribou is the longest I've

[00:22:16] been anywhere in Arizona I have not lived in a place that long in Arizona I've not worked in any

[00:22:22] other spot that long in Arizona and so it's my place room for 21 in Maribou I love that your response

[00:22:31] makes me think of a different question do you think it's important to find reasons to smile

[00:22:41] um just throughout our day or throughout our week uh if so why extremely

[00:22:51] and that is a lesson that I learned from my mom who was also my favorite person um you know

[00:22:59] we were going through it for a while I think I touched upon some of the topics that made life

[00:23:04] a little difficult when I was a young person for her more so even than me um but for both of us

[00:23:11] and um she is just a person who loves life though regardless and so she did

[00:23:21] always find ways to show me that there's so much joy in life even with hurt and wildly to me

[00:23:31] at the time now I get it but at the time she would be talking about you know the families on the street

[00:23:38] who are less fortunate and I was like what we are broke broke you know I mean our you know that kind

[00:23:43] of stuff for me was wild and then like I said I knew she was going through some extra hard stuff

[00:23:49] on top of it but she was out there worrying about the world you know and so but also I think in that

[00:23:58] because of her resiliency as a person she also then was able to still enjoy the times where

[00:24:04] she was not directly dealing with the hardship that she was going through and so you know then

[00:24:10] fast forward to me and my first 10 years of the teacher I was on that struggle bus thank you

[00:24:18] thank you for agreeing to take time out of your busy schedule right before vacation um to speak with

[00:24:28] me and share your wisdom in your inside I really appreciate it curry I hope this episode gave you

[00:24:34] some tools to connect with and increase your resiliency I'm proud of you let's keep up the

[00:24:40] momentum follow resilient life on your favorite podcast platform and on YouTube at resilient

[00:24:47] life podcast until next time be clear to yourself and others